# Fireside Chat with Reid Simon (Figure) and David Hoffman (Bankless) at ETHConf

- Speakers: [David Hoffman](https://streameth.org/speakers/david-hoffman)
- Channel: [ETHGlobal](https://streameth.org/ethglobal)
- Date: 2026-07-09
- Duration: 18:32
- Topics: Figure, Reid Simon, David Hoffman, Bankless, ETHConf, HELOCs, tokenization, RWAs, real world assets, Provenance, Democratized Prime, Morpho, DeFi, consumer credit, SoFi, Mike Cagney, securitization, warehouse finance, narrow banking, stablecoins, Ethereum, Solana, Kamino, SOFR, pension funds, insurance, family offices, curators, isolated markets, composability, auto loans, Gora, residential transition, SMB lending, trade finance, TVL, credit origination, yield, banks
- Watch: https://streameth.org/watch/yt-4dTLLqb349c
- YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dTLLqb349c

## Description

In this fireside chat, David Hoffman from Bankless sits down with Reid Simon from Figure to discuss how the company built one of the top 10 crypto assets by market cap through tokenized real world credit. Reid explains that Figure built quietly, creating a tokenization platform for HELOCs (home equity lines of credit), an esoteric consumer credit asset, now doing around $1.5 billion a month of natively tokenized HELOCs on the Provenance network, with TVL mirrored via CoinGecko for verifiability. Founded by Mike Cagney (also founder of SoFi), Figure operates as a capital light platform where about 380 partners plug into its tech stack for origination, credit decisioning, tokenization, trading, warehousing, and securitization across HELOCs, auto loans, residential transition, SMB, and inventory finance.

Reid explains why Figure chose HELOCs: traditional mortgage origination costs banks around $11,000 to $12,000, making small equity loans unprofitable, so blockchain's cheaper rails unlocked lending banks could not provide. Once tokenized, the asset needed utility, so Figure built Democratized Prime, a borrow-lend market against AAA rated HELOCs paying around 6.5% with hourly liquidity, recently connected to DeFi via a Morpho launch enabling financing near SOFR. He describes the new buyers unlocked by public blockchains: TradFi buyers like pension funds and insurers who buy tokenized mortgages in monthly securitizations, DeFi curators who dig into the historical loan tape, and net new capital like Asian family offices who cannot otherwise access American consumer credit. He frames banks as the primary middleman being removed, citing a narrow banking thesis, and explains the margin benefits: financing on Morpho at around 4.4% versus Goldman's 6.7% warehouse rate is a meaningful accelerant. He covers why Morpho on Ethereum made sense after an MVP on Solana with Kamino (deeper liquidity, isolated markets, composability), how Figure charges 50 basis points but treats it as a flywheel rather than a profit center, and how competitors like Securitize and Superstate compete through value chain partnerships. He closes on expansion into auto loans, residential transition loans, and SMB and trade finance, projecting Figure's Ethereum and Morpho TVL to reach the billions by year end.

00:00 Introduction
00:07 How Figure Became a Top 10 Crypto Asset
00:41 $1.5 Billion a Month in Tokenized HELOCs
01:03 Mirroring TVL via CoinGecko for Verifiability
01:25 A 101 on the Figure Business
01:52 From Lender to a 380 Partner Platform
02:19 The Full Stack of Credit Assets
02:42 Beyond First-Generation Tokenized Assets
03:05 Why Tokenizing HELOCs Is Just One Piece
03:30 Why Figure Picked HELOCs as an Asset
03:49 Why Banks Could Not Provide Small Equity Loans
04:29 Why Tokenized Assets Need Utility
04:56 Democratized Prime Explained
05:27 Connecting HELOCs to DeFi via Morpho
05:46 The New Buyers Public Blockchains Unlock
06:06 Why RWA Tokens Struggle With Liquidity
06:26 TradFi Buyers of Tokenized Mortgages
06:50 Democratizing Access to Warehouse Finance
07:17 Are Banks the Middleman Being Removed
07:35 The Narrow Banking Thesis
08:19 Accessing 160 Billion in Stablecoins
08:40 Two Sources of New Capital
08:58 Success With DeFi Curators
09:48 Asian Family Offices Accessing US Credit
10:33 The Margin Impact of the Opportunity
10:49 Why Cheaper Financing Accelerates the Business
11:13 Financing on Morpho Below SOFR
11:49 A Whole New Product of Prime Borrowers
12:11 Why Morpho Was the Right Platform
12:37 Why Ethereum Over Solana for Scale
13:02 Is Morpho a Profit Center or Distribution
13:23 Why It Is a Flywheel, Not a Profit Center
13:53 What Competitors Are Learning
14:31 Competing Through Value Chain Partnerships
15:03 What Is Next: New Assets Coming On Chain
15:37 Auto Loans, Residential, and SMB Lending
16:06 Is the Model Unique or Scalable
16:40 The Two Keys to Success
17:31 Sizing the Assets on Ethereum and Morpho
17:58 Projecting Billions by Year End
18:21 Closing

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