# Fireside Chat with Roham Gharegozlou, Dapper Labs, and Kartik Talwar, ETHGlobal I Pragma Sydney 2024

- Speakers: [Kartik Talwar](https://streameth.org/speakers/kartik-talwar)
- Channel: [ETHGlobal](https://streameth.org/ethglobal)
- Date: 2024-10-09
- Duration: 27:23
- Topics: Dapper Labs, Flow blockchain, NFTs, consumer crypto, Ethereum, EVM, Crescendo upgrade, CryptoKitties, NBA Top Shot, Disney Pinnacle, mainstream adoption, interoperability, smart contracts, wallet UX, developer ecosystems, DAU, Ticketmaster, digital collectibles, onboarding, composability, marketplace discovery, distribution, web3 gaming, Roham Gharegozlou, Pragma Sydney
- Watch: https://streameth.org/watch/yt-gTi9rx7i8bM
- YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gTi9rx7i8bM

## Description

Roham Gharegozlou, founder of Dapper Labs (CryptoKitties, NBA Top Shot, Disney Pinnacle), joins Pragma Sydney 2024 to discuss the future of consumer crypto applications. Learn how Flow blockchain is evolving with EVM compatibility to bridge Ethereum's ecosystem with mainstream adoption.

Roham shares insights from scaling NFT projects to millions of users, the challenges of interoperability, and why the next wave of crypto apps must balance seamless onboarding with open developer ecosystems. Discover why consumer crypto's "million DAU" milestone requires rethinking distribution, wallet UX, and community-driven utility beyond speculative trading.

00:00 - Introduction: Dapper Labs' Crypto Legacy
01:27 - From CryptoKitties to Mainstreaming NFTs
02:34 - Why NFTs Are More Than Buying/Selling
04:37 - Birth of Flow Blockchain: Scaling & UX
06:05 - Flow's Evolution: From Closed to Open Ecosystem
07:35 - Flow's EVM Compatibility & Crescendo Upgrade
09:06 - Bridging Cadence and Ethereum Smart Contracts
10:42 - Developer Reactions to Flow's New Direction
12:42 - Scaling Stats: Ticketmaster, Top Shot & Disney Pinnacle
15:09 - The Million DAU Challenge for Consumer Crypto
17:08 - Open vs Closed Developer Ecosystems
19:09 - Killer Apps vs Gradual Adoption Debate
21:31 - Wallets as Consumer Apps? Distribution Battles
23:55 - Who Owns the User Relationship in Web3?
25:49 - Marketplace Discovery vs Asset Distribution
26:38 - Advice for Consumer Crypto Founders

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _  

🇦🇺 *Pragma Sydney*
The Sydney edition of Pragma took place at The View by Sydney in May 2024 with a curated series of high-quality talks that sparked thought and discussion. Ever since we first introduced our new event series, Pragma, in Tokyo in the spring of 2023, we have been fostering a curated, global community of individuals who deeply care about web3. Watch the full Pragma Sydney playlist here: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXzKMXK2aHh7rvaHBM14peT1TwI3QX38p&si=MzGrEYwYjxSQFiFM

ETHGlobal's Pragma series takes place in cities around the world, and is designed to be a different kind of event. Pragma is a one-stage conference with founders-only on stage, bringing together a small group of curated attendees and speakers to discuss the future of web3 and reflect on the past. 

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _  

✅ *Follow Roham Gharegozlou*
X: https://x.com/roham

✅ *Follow Dapper Labs*
X: hhttps://x.com/DapperLabs

✅ *Follow ETHGlobal*
X: https://x.com/ETHGlobal​
Warpcast: https://warpcast.com/ethglobal
Website: https://ethglobal.com
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/ETHGlobal 

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _  

_Are you interested in Ethereum development and entrepreneurship?_
👉 Sign up for the next ETHGlobal event: https://ethglobal.com/events
🎁 Get exclusive access and perks with ETHGlobal Plus! https://ethglobal.com/plus
📣 Want us to throw an event in your city? Tell us where! https://ethglobal.com/city

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _