# Ethereum for the Next Billion: Who Are Your Next Billion? | Devcon Bogotá

- Channel: [Devcon](https://streameth.org/devcon)
- Date: 2023-10-07
- Duration: 48:13
- Watch: https://streameth.org/watch/yt-znkAg3fVDJ4
- YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znkAg3fVDJ4

## Description

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https://archive.devcon.org/archive/watch/6/ethereum-for-the-next-billion-who-are-your-next-billion/

Ethereum needs to overcome many gaps in representation across cultures, languages, ages, and more. This panel explores the question: "Who are the people that you consider to be the 'next billion' Ethereum users, and how will Ethereum make an impact on their lives?”

Panelists include Geoffrey See, Mary Davies, and Mihajlo Atanackovic with Chuy Cepeda as moderator.

Speaker(s): Ethereum Foundation Fellows, Mihajlo Atanackovic, Mary P. Davies, Chuy Cepeda, Geoffrey See
Track: Opportunity & Global Impact
Keywords: Global Impact,EFFellows,NextBillion

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Learn more about devcon: https://www.devcon.org/
Learn more about ethereum: https://ethereum.org/ 

Devcon is the Ethereum conference for developers, researchers, thinkers, and makers. 
Devcon 6 was held in Bogotá, Colombia on Oct 11 - 14, 2022.
Devcon is organized and presented by the Ethereum Foundation, with the support of our sponsors. To find out more, please visit https://ethereum.foundation/

## Transcript

foreign [Music] thank you everyone for being here can you raise your hand if you were in the rave last night it's a extra thanks for you for being here so I hope you had fun and I hope we can have fun in the next 15 minutes as the panel says we are going to talk about who are the next billion ethereum users and how can ethereum positively impact their lives I'm super privileged and honored to be here with the new fellows from Material Foundation mihelo Mary Joffrey and we're going to be talking about the different projects the different motivations why are there personally moved to be addressing this these next billion people they think they are going to be impacted by ethereum and when we start with a round of introductions um Marie do you want to go first sure my name is Mary P Davies and my project is the digital asset perpetuity project and the goal of the project is to answer the question what happens to your eth when you die where are you coming from tell us a little bit about your background Murray um I'm a legal technologist and a researcher I have a background in compliance and law and I did a master's thesis on basically digital assets that were things like Facebook pages and that kind of thing and it led me to looking at digital assets that have Fiat value and how to transfer those when you die and yeah that's basically how I how I got to where I'm at so it sounds that you are the kind of people that read the terms and conditions of everything right I do I read terms and conditions yeah I do okay okay okay and what brought you to the web Tree World what brought you to Defcon what how do you connect where you were coming from to this world well when you start looking at the trouble people have with with digital assets like a Facebook page or their or their email and then you think okay that's that's a problem but it's not something that they've invested tens of thousands of dollars in that suddenly disappears when they die I mean right now we have no process for transferring our digital assets when we die and as the value goes up and the popularity goes up that's going to become a bigger and bigger problem it sounds opportunity there yeah thanks thank you thank you Mary Joffrey do you want to introduce yourself sure thanks thanks so much uh so my name is Jeffrey I'm a co-founder at a y combinator back startup called Poco and I think for me how I'm involved as fallow and ethereum Foundation is that I've been looking a lot at how we can better get Regulators to interact with webtree technology and to learn and understand not just the technology that we have here but also the culture that we have around decentralization and how they can build better policies that that the intersection between decentralized and centralized systems interesting interesting actually there was a very hot conversation about Revelations right now before the panelist started Jeffrey can you tell us a little bit about your background are you an engineer are you yeah so I kind of took a almost like accidental journey into the regulation and policy making process I actually start out I got first introduced to Bitcoin in 2012 when I was in MIT doing research and then I was working on the product and Technology side of things launching a protocol in 2017 and then I found myself having to work a lot more with Regulators since then not the most fun thing to do but very important um and you know I was actually helping the Central Bank in Singapore kind of launch their experiments around blockchain technology so they can learn and understand what's going on there but I think my journey and interest in blockchain technology is a lot more personal okay uh so I used to run a non-profit that trained women entrepreneurs in an ofic sanctioned country uh we were doing everything compliantly and then one day the bank comes to us and they said hey uh you are operating a high-risk environment we're going to shut down your company's uh your non-profits bank account uh and and that was a huge blow to us it took a lot of time to sort out those issues and the worst part of it is that we didn't do anything wrong you know we were compliant the bank made a business decision around the risk they had to face and I see that problem happening again today where uh because of the perception of regulators and the pressure from Regulators they are conflating activities that are legitimate and illegitimate and I think vastly affecting the industry I think that's something that motivates me to help Regulators better understand what web3 is all about awesome Jeffrey so uh as as Mary was introducing herself and now Joffrey we can see that probably because we don't like to talk about that and because we don't like to talk with Regulators maybe we can find the next billion people there right so I mean hey look can you share a bit about you your motivations your background thank you Jay hello everyone my name is Michael I'm coming from the organization of the Scout movement this is where I lead the digital transformation and technological projects so can I say highlight this yeah like this like this okay okay yeah so I'm just scouting the room and so yeah I'm here with the Italian fellowship and my project is basically about looking into how how to Gear Up This the movement educational non non-formal educational Movement Like scouting is or 58 million members in 220 territories around the world how do we bring them and get them ready for web 3-0 how do we make how do we work with young people um you know and to understand the blockchain and to be the citizens of the of the the future world yeah and what about uh like like your your educational background where are you coming from in that sense sure uh my education background is project management okay then I basically all the time I was in the I.T type of projects and technological projects uh I volunteered for The Scouting for um for most of my life I was a scout and volunteered and then started very early actually to work for the world organization discount movement first in the European level and then later on now at the global uh headquarters which is now based in Malaysia for the past nine years awesome awesome love it so we can tell that perhaps from from and I I will try to oversimplify so no means to this respect so for my volunteering kind of approach from a legal Tech approach and from a policy making approach let's see and let's dig deeper into what's the next billion what we are thinking uh will be the next billion users for your turn Community um Jeffrey when we when you think or when you hear this question or when you joined the the next billion team I sent out their own fellow what's the Persona that comes to your mind can you describe that person or that stereotype or that yeah subject yeah so um we're doing a lot of work with the government of Kazakhstan to Pilot certain experiments around web tree technology and also web tree regulations um and I think the one thing that really stood out to me was that uh the Central Bank did a survey and they found that 25 of the population had exposure to crypto so and I think you'll see that consistent number going anywhere from 10 to 30 in most countries around the world and I think when you think about it there's really a population of like 70 that would not have touch uh any of these Technologies almost in every country in the world so I see it as a very very big pool of people who have not uh had access to crypto have not touched it and then once you think about actual decentralized technology because most people with their first exposures through on-rems through centralized exchanges uh once you think about actually say hey have you set up a metamask have you used any DM that number drops to maybe like five percent three percent and I think that's really the Gap that we're trying to close uh in a number of ways yeah interesting I I love when when these statistics come and they say like hey just in 2021 the crypto adoption went like like at two thousand percent like oh that's a lot but then just in Latin America is like 30 million people out of 650 million so it represents almost nothing there there is a billion here and there right Marie what about you what's what's the Persona that that you think well that comes to your mind when you think of the next billion well when I think of the next billion I don't I don't think of it from the perspective of a Persona I think of it more as a product and then I think what exactly are we selling to the next billion and if I drill down into it what I see is what we're selling is a trusted product and service and if we take if we take a step down from that what we're selling is Trust so what we need to do to reach the next build billion is to build the trust of our ecosystem and these products and services that we make because if people don't trust us they won't use us okay so interesting I'm I'm willing to dig deeper here but I don't know how to put it I'll come back I'll come back to that it will come to me can you can you describe the Scouts can you I believe that discounts are your personas right yeah that's that's actually what I have in mind I have in mind not just cows but young people the future uh future is in them and they we talk about building trust with The Regulators we talk about these challenges but the future Regulators will be the young people of today and those those people are not for into these Technologies and things um for them this is all more natural more open they're more open-minded there's less foreign less for them for them but what we need to do uh to to reach that uh one next billion I think we need to work um work with the young people thinking of the long-term future work in the presence work now with The Regulators work with the uh all the stakeholders right now and the people in the room but also think of the future and work with the young young Generations uh that will be the future regulator future users future and and you know mobilizing mobilizing more showing to the world that um blockchain is not only about crypto that is about doing good that is technology for good and showing them what I felt here when I came first day that this is really about everybody is in the mission of doing something good and solving some some real life problems so if we could build a trust by showing um to everyone more you know becoming from a niche from a niche group as you said that that growth becoming a mainstream and the path is to build the trust and and make make ourselves more open and I believe that the web tree and blockchain ecosystem in general has a lot to learn about these clouds the scouts kind of organically or naturally organized in different nodes right let's say it's a very interesting approach to to see things so I I became an auditorium fellow during a hard years this is the first time I met well the next billion team in person uh but even though we we didn't have the time to share in person a term Foundation helped me a lot because I worked with public institutions because I want to to teach public servants and also serve technology and also bring them into web trade Technologies and kind of get into your government portal and instead of creating a digital profile just connect your wallet so that kind of approach for us was let's jump into the web tree and let's bring institutions into the laboratory that was my approach to applying into a term foundation and to become a fellow and to try to learn how the information can help us and how we can also help the term ecosystem when you think of that when you think of how you applied to become an ethereum fellow what's the problem you were describing with this person as what's what's that thing that personally moves you to be tackling or addressing or trying to gather these next billion people Joffrey do you wanna yeah sure um I think the the big gap with um working in Regulators is that they and policy makers is that they don't you know going back is like the problem statement I had was that they don't understand the culture they don't understand the technology you ask a regulator have they use a metamask um none of them would have done it I just want to check you know in the audience is there any Regulators or policy makers in this audience here raise your hand if anyone okay so so I think that's uh they clearly need to go for them right yeah you can't understand the culture without being here without feeling it and interacting with the community and the approach that we are taking uh is to get Regulators to experiment with the technology uh so in Kazakhstan for example we are working with the government uh on two different projects uh one is around uh provision of public services so they have a national I.T Park they have a bunch of Education uh activities around it and they say Hey you know if we transform this into a Dao a decentralized autonomous organization uh what does it look how will people use the technology uh you know will people need to how do they open up wallets how do they use those wallets to interact with each other these are things that are very very new to most people in the world and they want to experiment and try and see to understand exactly what it is that they're dealing with here um the other thing is that they are introducing a national crypto Fiat rail by mandate but then as they start doing it they say oh you know we have all the stakeholders with all these different issues you know how do we think about it you know what's happening out there um and I think learning by doing is just so critical uh in trying to understand the web tree space from a policy maker perspective interesting and there's a new customary is there any like personal motivation that you feel that it's moving you uh to to to tackle the problem that you're referring I love how you introduce yourself and it's I am Mary I'm working on how to do what will happen to you it when you die so it's really good but is is there anything that is actually moving you towards there uh is there anything you want to share on how you apply to their information how you describe this problem and what moves you to be kind of pulling these next billion people towards the ecosystem well I think that without getting all deathy when people die transferring assets from the individual to their estate is extremely complicated it it involves not only inheritance laws state law but contract law Privacy Law and and it isn't as simple as just handing over the asset and the laws are very old and they're complicated and they're different jurisdictions have different laws and in some jurisdictions multiple laws apply and I thought that the way to approach the problem of what happens to your youth when you die is to at first build a database of all of the laws that apply across the world to transfer of assets on death and then to look for patterns in those laws and then to sort of compile that as a list of requirements and then approach the community and say these are the legal problems that we have with assets transfer on death how do we use our technology to solve them and that that was the sort of driver that that got me going and realizing that if we disrupt what I call disrupt from within if we look at how it works now and look at what needs to be reformed and changed and how technology can replace things like Wills need a wetting signature that's crazy they need to be on paper that's crazy I mean we have technology that can do that without either of those requirements but unless we know whether those unless we understand the law enough to know that that solution will work I think we risk having flying in the face of disruption right and and being opposed by the powers that regulate that sort of thing rather than being accepted by them interesting um and it's you just made me think that when we die and when we have money in a regular Bank like Fiat like for example in Mexico you have no will and no one claims it the bank just used his money yeah that's the way it goes uh but but here when we're thinking about the eat for example it's bad for you and it's bad for the ecosystem because it got luck so the problem gets bigger and bigger right and that's a problem it's a problem for an individual but it's also a problem for our ecosystem if if uh digital assets are frozen or I mean think of a I think of a service provider that has the Frozen Ethan on his books how do they handle that I don't know so yeah it is and also the going back to my trust point if they if we can't be to transfer assets the way other assets transferred are people going to trust eth itself or digital assets registered on blockchain with smart contracts so it is it's a it's a multiple layer problem very interesting yeah very interesting problem so uh going to Yumi hello uh are you thinking of an actual problem or an opportunity that that is personally moving you to to kind of persuade these 58 million people you said yeah 58 million people to come in so what what are you thinking what what are your thoughts behind that so as a scouting is in as a scout as myself and scouting is in a mission of creating better world we do that by creating better citizens for the future we do that by providing them non-formal education opportunities so bringing this other education that nobody talked about so much or is not but it's actually bigger and in some cases also more relevant especially in today's uh times where education is evolving so education uh education education so it's really really about that so personally I am um I'm on that mission looking into how we educate more young people to do to use this how we get more and more users um and how we with that spark their um curiosity and there so it's not that we are giving and this is how you do it so you go and be doer but hey this is how you do how you do it but you can think of other solution another way to build something on this and feel free and how do we Nutrish that Community within community so my my goal would be to create one of the things I would do in the project is to create a community within scouting that works on the blockchain the scouts who are interested about battery web 3-0 and blockchain and and support their work basically not not direct them not guide them but just support their issues and I'm thinking to do that like a Dao Community as well also within the scouting yeah so um yeah I believe that's that's the answer for this I think very interesting I can think about multiple things from from digital identity and I remember uh Danny Ryan sharing on the opening that the probably the next steps for for The Ether ecosystem are not going to be Financial but perhaps tapping into the potential of identities and and I can see an opportunity here in Dallas um yep just one thought uh about the debt that you mentioned in the identities you remind management a very important problem that we look into solving are it's a big challenge of today of course is the child abuse abuse of any kind not a child but anyone adult young people anywhere any abuse any any form of abuse I am very interested to figure out how technology can help us in that so and I believe there is a way you can help us it's it's about yeah impartial unit education but partially also about figuring out the system and mechanisms for creating a safe environments for everyone I think that's also something I'm very like motivated and driven to so that would be one of the important initiatives within scouting very interesting and I can see uh the kind of the the hard part of the motivation behind so and that's that's what we need to get the next billion to be like Purpose Driven and persist uh and that's going to be that's gonna be it so before I jump into opening questions and opening the floor for for the audience to to tap into different things on around your what you have been sharing I would love you to share where are you going or how do you think the ethereum ecosystem can help you to reach this next billion uh do you have any any challenges in mind do you do where do you see yourself in six months from now into reaching this next billion Jeffrey you want to go yes I think one of the issues um you know where I see this decentralized system meeting centralized system uh kind of bumping up against quite frequently um I think it's in the crypto Fiat rails and I do believe that that's still very much the call through which most new users uh in the world will start to get access to this ecosystem uh and I think it's something that there needs to be uh ways to kind of facilitate that and make that a more seamless transition and in many parts of the world it's getting a lot more restrictive you know I go to my bank and I say my company is dealing a lot with crypto uh you know the bank community says oh high risk customer forget it I'm going to shut down your bank account uh so I think that's one area uh you know I love to talk to people you know if they have to have to deal with these issues especially from a kind of compliance I love to engage with people to to learn about you know kind of the conversations they're having uh in a confidential Manner and and you know what best uh what can best be done to persuade Regulators that there isn't the kind of risk that they imagine exists in this ecosystem uh the other part I'm super excited about actually is um gaming I'm a gamer um and I believe that actually in Southeast Asia uh where I live I'm currently in Vietnam um I think games is a very very great way to introduce a lot of people that don't have um experience kind of uh with this ecosystem and get them into it uh even the the dial that we are working at the national iot park in Kazakhstan it actually came out from an original thinking where they are trying to say how do I gamify the experience and involvement of my community with the infrastructure that we have and now it's extended into the web tree space so I think you know that's another area I'm just super excited about I would love to talk to people who know the web 3 gaming space better than I do awesome awesome Murray where do you see or what's the obstacle what's the challenges that we are seeing up front in the next six months for your project and for reaching this next billion well I think in six months we'll have a database of all the law that applies to the transfer of digital assets when you die um I'm gonna need it it'll be no I want it to be an open source database so I'm going to need some sort of a platform to record it and make it accessible to people and then the next step is to create the list of legal requirements for what needs to happen in different jurisdictions and then what I'm hoping is that the community will be able to look at those and say okay we've got the technology to do this and this we can solve this problem with a technical solution and that that that's the sort of vision for the next phase of my project okay interesting what about what about you Milo do you do you see any any challenges there I mean I can take a picture some of them but what are you what do you see your like your next steps can you share with the audience you're going sure thank you so we'll start with the smaller bites of course and the things that would be easy and will actually be a um something that Scouts will be very motivated and easy going to to accept is there will of course start creating or putting the the Scout badges into the uh and turning them into the nft badges and putting them in a via Pope and other technologies will put them into into the wallet so we'll have Scout wallet with Scout badges um so that will help Scouts bring on Scouts on like on a Basics on a you know first level understanding having you know what's the hash what's the private key what's the um what's the nft what's the what's the wallet and then we go into deeper we go into like again having these champions in in um inside of the community looking into how um what projects we could get into into what projects we could do what are the most relevant ones I heard so many good ideas since I came here about what we can do in scouting for example I you mentioned we are decentralized yes we have local Scout groups everywhere in this neighborhood also there is a scout group actually um and they are in they they need some support in like creating a simple a treasury um a treasury mechanism with a blockchain or um you know they also like scouting is voluntary LED meaning that people are voted for and elected to lead and and then to you know represent um them in the other circles so using Dao there and things like that so I what I'm looking forward from this community is like ideas and openness maybe to suggest some things and help us actually do these things we are non-profit and yeah we're looking forward for anyone who want to partner uh on a doing good basis and and do something great together solve some big problems awesome awesome I remember when I was a kid I was a I used to be a scout um and I remember having different means because of the different accomplishments or Milestones so now we're going to have pull-ups maybe right exactly um so there's 25 more minutes here and I believe that this is a good amount of time for opening uh to to the floor like anyone in the audience wants to to pick the Brilliance of these fellows and how they are planning to reach the next billion users one sec buddy hello great to meet you all fantastic work you're doing um uh one of the things some of the things I heard is the use cases that you are all approaching are kind of existing use cases payments smart contracts maybe DIY or credentialing at least for Scouts um and so what it sounds like is like we've done well for these first billion with this use case let's push that to another billion um Jeffrey you mentioned gaming are there other use cases that you see as you look at different sort of populations or is it a matter of we've got some good use cases we just need to reach more people I'm just curious about your thoughts on a macro level on that stuff yeah um so I think the so for me the way I look at this is that when I think of the next billion um uh it's that I think different countries interact and learn about crypto in in very different ways right so going back to the Kazakhstan uh example it was quite interesting because what happened in Kazakhstan was that China banned Mining and all the miners fled to Kazakhstan and then they were like at first they panic because you know they consume a lot of electricity Kazakhstan 1.0 number one or number two hash rate in the world and the government panic and they they overreacted and they kind of climbed down on it and then after that they said hey this is actually a very interesting industry you know we need to do more or more about it more in it and then they started inviting uh exchanges back into Kazakhstan you know binance set up there a bunch of other exchanges went in there and and got established um so I I think it's the way I look at it is too that um we need new applications that provide benefit to people on a day-to-day basis um but I think that the pool of people that we have not touched uh is still very very huge because you go in there and they they are at the beginning of learning about this uh most of them would still not have a metamask wallet um 25 of population owns digital assets um but you know there is a lens and a process in which some of these countries learn about crypto and I think it's still a very very early stage in terms of the 75 or 80 of each of these countries that you know crypto has not touched it so to build on that and about the use cases and this is more tapping into my experience uh from the previous year being an ethereum fellow working with the public sector typically they don't there's no one wanting to be the Pioneer Pioneer they want to be the second Pioneer the third Pioneer but not the first one right uh so so winning these small battles having these different use cases is always super relevant this kind of a divide and concur approach it's more on the on the mindset of them uh we start for example with uh just verifiable credentials for commercial permits that was a very simple thing and then at some point we started certifying City inspectors and policemen so that you were able to actually scan and see if that was an actual policeman doing their job and then we started into construction permits and then we are now thinking about legislation uh there's actually a congresswoman here doing that thing she's using her WhatsApp right now but now she's she's helping with the legislation right now but because of the use cases so after we moved with around 50 different implementations different flavors just as the ones I've done I just mentioned we were able to start thinking about law initiatives and after law initiatives you can start thinking about how regulation can foster innovation no block Innovation and then after that we start stitching the ecosystem and saying hey can we have standards can we share the same thing when we talk about Identity or public sector credentials or or a sense of ownership of your digital assets and then we are now integrating even with more webtree services so everything departed from the use cases and that this was just to highlight the relevance of your questions so thank you Jeffrey do you want to add on that actually just want to add a quick point I think because you you raised something very interesting in terms of how regulators think about this technology um I think one of the part I one of my biggest fear is that uh there is different use cases for webtree in different countries right if I'm a small country I might think differently if I'm a big country I want to regulate a different way because I have different interests at stake and what I see in this space is because most of them do not understand the technology and don't have access to the expertise they will just copy the US most of the time and the US chooses to regulate web Tree in a way because they have particular policy interest that doesn't isn't the same shed interest as all these different countries so definitely there's there's a Snowball Effect here you have the more problems you find the more business and impact opportunities you find right as well so any other question anyone wants to jump in hi so uh I was thinking is there any way that uh um the ethereum foundation is documenting this kind of like growth building blocks on how um like every single one of you have a different approach on how we can reach that next billion uh so is there any kind of like documentation on how that like the growth building blocks are starting to merge with the patterns that you're discovering do you have any plans of sharing any of that kind of documentation do you have any plan to kind of should be limited no it's a good question I mean we have plans to look into understand a little bit what where what's the the stage zero where we are at the moment and then to measure throughout the step the the time of this projects what's the impact made and and what's the like what has changed from that zero so for example for my project I'll be looking into where we are and scouting and there's identifying some use cases and we'll be identifying if someone is already working on it on the national local levels of identifying you know the interest in that sense and then on the end I would also measure a little bit how that increased for example uh over hopefully over the six months I think um you know this is a experiment in itself right I think we are figuring out uh ourselves how do we best achieve the impact that we want but I think the point you raise about sharing I think is really really crucial because what I noticed with policy makers is that or even Banks right so we're trying to say hey Banks please Bank people with crypto and their first response is that oh it's very very high risk can you point out to other people that are doing it so that we can have a sense that what we're doing is kosher and and I think that sharing is just so important right when it comes to a policy process because honestly most policy makers and Regulators are conservative they don't want to stick their neck out and they'll rather say okay you know who else has done it and then I can go back and explain to my stakeholders that I'm not trying to be too crazy here remember you were saying about uh building this uh database or repository of the different flavors of regulations that we have uh so are you planning to to open source to show it somehow what are your plans on that yeah absolutely because I think that it will help companies when they're putting together projects and they write their terms and conditions like today I think the only thing you can put in is that there is a risk that when you if you die holding this account you will lose everything that's in it and I think once we get a little bit more knowledge about the different laws it may end up being that we have three or four different variations based on where you're resident in the world because you know not only where your resident where the asset is resident and where the person dies that those things all Impact how Property Transfers so yeah it the plan is definitely to make this open source and ultimately to create a standard of how whatever our solution is so that it's you it I have a vision in my head of it being something like an nft standard where there's there's one way of it's done and it works for all all concerned it would be interesting and an interesting documentation challenge to think of six months and having your documentation documentation for web 3 wheel kind of thing right it will be very interesting that's the long-term Vision yes yeah definitely that'll take a while because we have to go through law reform before we get there final problem yeah on a very bright practical note on that um me being a fellow from the previous cohort what we built was a different notion sites so everything is open uh there is even a blog post at ethereum.org and you can go to the blog and you can see you can actually go to my Twitter and you'll you'll see the peanut tweet there so we try to blog we try to say videos and we and particularly notion work well as a tool to sharing different information so that may that may answer your question in a very practical approach so anyone else yes please can hey Jose I'm from Brazil so thank you for like brainstorming for the adapting the next billion one thing I believe we're all working here a lot for an incremental change how we incrementally improve something we have between our hands um like we were working on the hackathon like a couple of days ago and there is one thing for instance the address the wallet address which is the very very very basic something for anybody coming to ethereum or any crypto do you have to set up a wallet address for him the wallet address by itself whatever in ethereum which is hexadecimal or in Bitcoin it use a Latin actor which is already exclusive there is 20 30 percent of population they can't recognize the Latin character you know like there is there is the ones they recognize the Latin character and hexadecimal for them is like extremely weird but there is the ones they don't even recognize it and that's already 1.5 billion of population we have today so we work it we actually won the prize on this part the re like presenting the wallet address on shape like instead of having it hexadecimal I can let the numbers one to ten ABCD FD we having it hard Square which is shapes and colors something kids could recognize and my grandma can there is some stuff like very basic I would say just like instead of us working incrementally to improve something exist maybe we try to think about it against scratch from zero it's like how if this if I don't have anything how I would Express this how I would do this if I don't have anything already exist I just want to share this and and I appreciate really your work on the incremental and I know as like as anybody working in a domain Focus head you have to increment but yeah how do you feel about like scratching something just like let's throw this all away and scratch some some some brainstorm from zero yeah thank you thank you thank you for your question I'll try to reframe it a little bit coming from the use cases and documentation approach so this is from how kind of financial scaling question and and particularly addressing the language barrier uh as a Brazilian there's always this thing that we have with like hey do we have the Latin American Gathering and everyone is speaking in Spanish and it feels weird right uh so I've lived University for a couple of years and and I know uh where this comes from in a sense of language uh and how it kind of becomes an extra challenge for us also uh talking about blockchain Cadena de blockes doesn't sound that sexy you do one blockchain right so this kind of small steps that are on the language kind of barriers for scaling do you have anything to share like do you have a thought of any strategies can you can you share anything I'd love to share a little bit of that because I feel touched on a very important issue about really how how can it be more inclusive the ecosystem and I feel one part of kind of is a huge long gripe of mind is how the ux itself is can be exclusive an example is that you know I live in many places where the GDP per capita is under two three thousand dollars uh so it's not very very rich places and when you make a mistake with your wallet on gas fees or anything it's very expensive you know me losing three bucks if I'm in the US because I made a mistake on my transaction it's not a big problem me working with someone in Vietnam uh who loses like three bucks or ten bucks because they made some mistake on the transaction that's a huge amount of money uh and and I think there needs to be ways to make the ux more inclusive um I think what you're suggesting might be One Direction but just I think there's many many of these little things that can be done to make it just a much more inclusive ecosystem yeah I would like to add on this inclusivity is very important it's a very good topic and very good ideas out there don't think we should think of anything that we have so far and now as a set in stone as a founding founding things that we should never touch uh that will put us in a very long step we need to be criticizing and everything which have a critical thinking over everything uh maybe it worked but it at some point but it didn't thought of everything inclusively now when we have this mind when we have this conscious of that we were not inclusive we should go back and be criticizing on any of the solutions that we have that are not inclusive so I think that's very important to like be be open-minded to this and and just like challenge everything that we have if it's if it's not inclusive enough nothing is Secret in a way secret and safe uh in insane in that sense not to be touched so man well I'm getting a little bit ahead of my project but I suspect that once we've gathered all the data we're going to be jumping from in most places paper documents to some other form of solution so yeah I think there is a possibility to rewrite the whole how the process is done as long as we work within the legal framework to do that so yeah coming back to to the original approach about language our white paper was written in Spanish the Spanish first and it has been a quite challenged because most of the people want to read it in English but we want to reach most of people Spanish speaking so it is like no no it was written for you but no no but I want to read your white paper in English no no but it was written first but so so yeah I I feel that challenge a lot so we have 10 more minutes and I would love for them to have also some kind of a closing remarks so maybe we have a room for one or two questions so there's one person over there please hi I'm Maggie thank you so much for sharing and talking on this panel so my question is actually about building trust so um how do you actually build trust within the audiences that you serve because I think ethereum for the next billion is a really big topic that all of us are looking to work towards but I think like on the other side for people that don't know about ethereum or people that are end users um what are some of the challenges for building trust Within These communities and what are some of the things that you're doing already to do that I love that question particularly because from the different audiences that you're addressing these next billion people the first care when they think about Bitcoin they feel bouncy schemes they feel scams they feel all these things that we were discussing before so please jump and and can we have our 20 minutes please sure if I if I may just like I think we just need to be stay more open and show what the good things are we doing and what we want to to do with like there is that it's not about making a personal gain and it's not about ethereum it's not about that it's so much about solving the real real problems I guarantee you people who are not in this room or not in the ethereum committee have no clue about that and just finding ways how do we bring that so bring them on talk to your friends Advocate bring them together you know organize talks and and disclose all of this talk about you know instead of them asking you so what about this is about cryptocurrencies you can make no no no let me explain you what this is about actually and what is what it does so like going to that I think going into this um being more open and being you know like taking off the hoodie and showing that we are we are human and we are people and and we want to you know be open not just like a close little uh room that you can't access actually unless you are part of the community I think we were just chatting before this session about expectations pre-devcon and in Devcon um and I remember you said like oh you know I taught people be lining up outside with the Ferraris and the conversation all about Lambo Lambo Lambo um and I think it's a very different vibe we actually got coming down here and I think uh you know one thing I feel is like regulators and policy makers that is their impression of the community uh and if they if more of them come to this event I think they would understand it a lot better and I think that's something that uh you know has to be done uh to build that trust where they actually see hear and interact uh with the community to understand the values of this community and I think to add to that I think our our style of communication I think we need to remember that our audience doesn't come with the backgrounds that we have and that we if we can I like to I like to bridge things so it's like something you're doing already but it's a little bit different so that they're not completely intimidated by what it is we're doing um and then to perhaps touch it slightly controversial nerve we were talking about this earlier I think we need to self-regulate I think that when we have incidents in the community that are not good we need to be seen to be disapproving of those incidents because if you look at what mainstream media tends to cover it's things like hacks or exploits of some sort and that doesn't make us look good yeah there is a lot of to build on self-regulating these communities as the Opera was asking when she said live is there any regulator here no one raised a hand so there's this means that there's people making rules for how we should operate or build and determ ecosystem that they are not in this room that they are not filling their surprise so it is our responsibility to bring them here and also for us to visit them and to share and to grab this next billion uh is there any other question sorry just that to be open-minded with that you know to understand like where they're coming from and what their pain problem points are problems are and how do we navigate through that instead of being angry on them you know we have a tendency when we hear from them like we will forbid this is not going to work and it's never you're like no you're stupid no you should just turn this different like different really be what we are a good people open our mind and open heart like with the with a clean heart so come into that talks with a clean you know open-mindness and and and you know good intentions and also good like good good heart you know this this is also why I love the traffic principle graphic design principles on web3 if I jump with this shirt into any political party they don't know who I'm rooting for so I'm as inclusive as possible right so this is kind of the message to bring the next billion to to show every single color and bring them uh any other question well there's probably one minute one minute and a half I would love for you to share any closing remarks hopefully optimistic on how the ethereum ecosystem can positively impact the life of the next billion and how people can reach you hello yeah sure I can do uh I can start I think we just need to stay humble but then on the other hand uh be more open help help others look for you know one week once we saw one problem look for another problem we can solve there are so many problems in this world but uh and and maybe we cannot solve them all but we can solve a lot so um that's a big task to do and if we are oriented always to that to look into how we solve some of the real real problems then um then we will stay on a good path and it will be recognized better it will be be more and more seen as someone who's uh who is part of the solution rather the part of the problem and we need to prove we're not doing that not only to prove that as we know we're doing that for for a good reasons for the good cause but just staying with this good cause always and this value system uh would be very important I think um I think closing death and the transfer of assets is a is a challenging expensive complicated problem and I think once we get a baseline of what rules apply to it I know that the ethereum community has created a solution and I'm counting on the development teams in the in the room to help with this because we will be we will be sparing people heartache and we're sparing them cost and complication and for a lot of folks it's a legal process that they don't have access to lawyers and if we can make it something that is done automatically and driven by the holder of the asset I think we can improve people's lives yeah I think the one word that really stands out for me um is inclusiveness um and I think the way I see it is that you know we should be thinking about who should be a part of this conversation but it's not a current part of the conversation uh so I think for me you know my thought is that I'm going to have a bring bring a policy maker bring a regulator to an event uh mindset I think the future where you know if they are not you know they are dealing with these issues but they are not part of this conversation part of this community or part of the the environment here uh it's it's something a burden that I should take to make sure that you know they are able to come here and participate in all of these things so thank you very much I just want to close with sharing experience and experience that I had a couple of years ago pre-pandemic um I was in a global government Summit um actually was an open government partnership Summit in Ottawa in Canada uh and to my surprise I was I was feeling like the only Technologies there and to my surprise one of the first conversations at in this stage was Tim berners-lee so he was sharing all his thoughts on how he envisioned the internet and how he's thinking the web tree will look like or the next internet or the next web uh and when he stepped down of the of the scenario say like hey you know probably probably you and me are the only Technologies here like what brought you here do you actually think that the web tree or the next internet is going to be better and he said just like the internet the web tree is like a sidewalk there's going to be good people and bad people walking through it so that's a message use it well bring the next billion for positively impacting the lives of the many thank you [Applause]