OtterTank | Essengo | September 2023 Edition

foreign [Music] our last project of the night and Sango by Chris [Applause] hello everybody my name is Christian proof someone would like to know me as a teacher somebody you know might know me as a lab researcher I was actually hoping somebody would recognize me here today from my Origins which is the other card Market here in Amsterdam enjoy my life eat my chicken I put so much effort into that okay whatever so but all of this has brought me here today to this moment to present you this idea and sengo which means join or happy in Swahili and I have a question to start you off with it's live right and how does local marketplaces look in the digital future because I see the rise of large multi-market places like Amazon eBay and they kind of eat all the small players in display chain don't they and I thought that was quite unfair and well as a supply chain researcher you started looking to the Dynamics of that and maybe you can change that and so I thought to change that too um to bring you into this mindset let me give you a lesson from my father um of marketplaces right these are games games that you play repeatedly um so let's have a look at the game of the farmer right now let's see here right now if I'm farming right if I'm a farmer or if I'm into or agriculture at all it's an extremely risky business because everybody is basically walking around blind we have no idea what the market was we have no idea what's good for it we don't know where our products come from we don't know how they're made and we don't know who we can trust as a result what should I do with my firm I don't know gamble as my father I would say aside from that the entire system apparently is set up in such a way that is very advantageous for me to screw you to be dishonorable with my agreements to not tell you who my partners are to not tell you where my sources are or how I make it at the moment how the game is structured it's a race to the bottom the way that supply chain Dynamics work it basically eliminates the weakest partner but because we don't have any transparency in it what actually happens is that the supply chain hits itself and you get horrible things happening at the bottom that the top doesn't have any clue about basically the whole proposition is a very very Risky Business and if I was a bank or an investor or anybody a new player in this I would not go for it the economic storm make any sense so if we're talking about sustainability or growth and stuff like that and tackling the CO2 problem how about we first look at the farming Dynamics game if that makes sense try to improve that and then we can talk about additional stuff so what I want to change it to R is the right side hello hello thank you very much yes through new cool technologies that we're going to combine together I want to give a feedback loop in Supply chains because as at the moment we're doing it pretty blindly so I want to share information however if you know anything about supply chain doing that everybody says it Nobody Does it why because the game is against me I want to screw you over because I can take your business so I need to have a different reason to not screw you over and that's just the way the awesomeness blockchain comes into we can make a trust record now another problems come in when you bring in these kubernet kind of things and and that in combination with supply chain and that rule supply chain if I have a hurdle and you're you're in it I will eliminate you if I can so any pricing or stuff like that if I can walk around it or legal rules if I can work around it and get away with it I should it makes sense so I want to change that I want to take it with a single I basically want to change the risk and risk and reward dynamics of it make it easier for all players all right next slide so I actually know that and I encountered a couple of new guys from friendly RV these guys didn't obviously listen to me or ever met me before they did the risky thing they went to the Democratic Republic of Congos and they actually started a farm they encountered all of the problems that we know that they would encounter and stuff like that they basically make a very very cheap risky Venture they're still alive um at least the company is still alive but it still hasn't made a profit they're they're encountering all of these problems so next 26 seconds really okay so it's a two-part solution one is a neutral identity system to enable peer-to-peer trading which is not owned by anybody basically owned by the user itself the second one is let it's a neutral Marketplace and we base this on a very unique new technology basically it's an ideation of blockchain next I where we do one thing we move centralization right pick this specific video right so when we have ah I move the circularization aspects to appear to be on fun places [Applause] go ahead roast me yeah really get to what you're doing yes [Music] in three sentences in three sentences we are trying to make the game around farming fair for all parties in both by lowering the risk creating a trust layer between them that is truly neutral a two-part solution one is a a single ID this is a new innovation on blockchain where we basically store all of the information on the origin phone itself and the network is only there to facilitate movement as aware not locking users in any system and it's also a neutral system that works on its own so it doesn't need a blockchain to run that's the whole point and the second part is this Marketplace and the smart place is a separate initiative to be a neutral local to local platform that is focused on region so instead of with Amazon where you have one platform to glue the whole this doesn't take into account all of the factors of supply chain distance quality where are you searching it for just kind of stuff so you need local initiatives on the grounds that are like clusters that are not owned by anybody okay okay so yes you know I I think we probably all agree here I think your pitch needs a bit more Focus yes because we if you come out of a five minute pitch and nobody knows what the use cases or what the solution is yes that's a problem thank you so I think that that really does need to be uh improved a bit I think maybe some of your earlier slides was slight Mis characterization of the current state of farming because it's not like farmers are completely blind it's not like it's a total gamble I think our farming expert in the crowd here somewhere the more itself can go the less the more of a gamble it becomes right but like there are things like farming futures for instance with farmers can block in prices before you know they even start to sow their seeds so I mean these are examples where you know some of the things you claiming of problems are not necessarily as big of a problem as you know you're making it out to be in this presentation maybe not in this presentation but I have to take it to back it up okay so so maybe maybe let's go back to the to the farmers and went to Africa rights the three guys yeah yeah so so what programs did they face one of the main the main problem that they face back peace um so one of the coolest uh or uh refreshing to the other landfill things they have the problem first first problem uh the bottom left that they bought turned out to be a different part of that um the workers that they had turned out to be the wrong workers also they had no insurances that it would actually show up and sometimes people would pay in advance so let's go back to the first thing the documentation right try to let yeah so how do you solve for that so how are you going to solve that they're going to buy the right land and they actually end up on the right and how are you going to solve that with your application what we do is we if you and then we kind of need to go back to the article to take your side but what we do is we separate the identity and the data object into two different things where we only send the data object so say for example the documentation to another party and the verification of this depends on what I can see about you in the past so how does it look like for an end user so how what is the difference between using your application and just going to Africa and the difference is that if you were a trainer on this right and I have no idea who you are in a normal system I would just have to trust the platform to kind of know if you're doing your thing here I get an entire record of all the things that you did in the past not exactly what you did but that you did it this builds a reputation and also gives you a different incentive to do your business instead of saying I'm going to screw you over for one time to make an extra Buck you wouldn't possibly want to risk your entire reputation or making that kind of mistake and this is for all parts of the chair so go ahead yeah yeah so so it seems like the solution though like the problem that you're solving is dependent upon everyone already using this system and signing into this reputation system it's kind of like a chicken before the egg problem isn't it correct this is why we start with the a single idea in the marketplace separate and the essential idea is it it's essential that it works for the company already on its own so it doesn't need a blockchain solution in order to function yeah either let's say that's a good bridge over to my next question yeah why do you need a blockchain first that's cool when you take the blockchain out you see exactly why in a non if you try to do this without blockchain I don't have a trust verification system to tell me who you are also the automatic escrow is known as the customer how do you solve the problem of garbage and garbage out um you're that's a very interesting question so this may be a long procedure okay and your trust truth starts with yourself first and then uh you build your reputation over time I can't prevent you from garbage garbage out so is this like a whip of trust type design well because it's a web of trust but it's a truly distributed web of trust not a decentralized type of trust that's it maybe that's that's yeah that's a bit of a good point honestly um yeah because the thing is these type of identity systems if you also it's not entity system essentially I mean reviews yes yes yeah the problem is is that you're running into a bunch of unsolved problems here essentially like sure you create an identity system without some sort of centralized Authority or Oracle as far as I'm concerned it's not an unsolved problem to do that in a decentralized manner well that um I don't know if I have the solution but I think I want to test it so we have Theory and testing and not you know that's all great because Winds of trust are notoriously needs to get their ground right yeah this is why we're starting this is why I'm selecting These Guys these are a small farmer that has the problems in the region that is actually there um to grow from to test it with them first right instead of building it so just to be clear the claim is specifically I like to be specific the claim is is that your app will help them they should stick with the first example here get the right documentation and get the right um buy the right land because all the people involved are it's in this reputation system and based on that it makes it very easy for me to build my reputation it seems I I just don't understand how you get there in the first place we need to document but this is exactly why I'm here because very academically talking right that's interesting but I need to now crush it down and I'm really a gentleman again in it it's it's difficult um I think entrepreneurship is very difficult I appreciate you coming up here it takes courage to come up on stage and to present your idea um and and to essentially pitch so so good on you for that um I haven't said that the the critical feedback is is of course what's already been said like you really got to work on your pitch um you really don't practice especially if you like stand up on stage you know it's going to be a crowd like it needs to be a lot clearer than this like practice 100 times like it has to be on point because I still don't understand what you do um and I don't understand like why you'd even need a blockchain for this I think there's no need um and I think I think that the for at this stage like you have this Grand idea but that's that's the that's the killer of Entrepreneurship like you're not going to be able to handle like this entire even this slide all the stuff that's on it like you're not going to be able to do that like you've got to get overwhelmed so it suggests like start with a very small problem first and try and solve for that and if you can solve them around the blockchain then solve a better blockchain like you don't need to shut blockchain in there so things like documentation like like you said that reputation is unsolved but you know it works really well on Amazon right or it works really well on I know these other things yeah right but of course I'm just saying Amazon didn't start with a Marketplace of everything right so and that's that's what it looks like for you right Amazon started we're just saying books right to a very small set of people right so so the same thing here is like my suggestion would be like really traffic down to one core problem that you could actually go for and then like do that um and then I think that will inform the rest of the product development yes because it's that's why it's all over the place that's why I don't understand it because it's like there's too many things involved but it's not it's not focused enough yeah thanks for that I have to agree with Dave of course um so if you see uh these two people there on the top maybe also be a good idea to have them describe the problem they're facing having set up the farm so people in the audience the people you're pitching to understand the problem suggesting that I put movies in it no maybe yeah this this is too short I know but maybe if you're going to pitch somewhere else you can have these guys explain what they're what they have been facing and why your application is the solution um as a movie instead of it's like maybe you can also just shoot yeah yeah I guess so yeah because you'll show these guys and I I can see so there's a problem so that's good you found that there's a problem and there's a need for a solution uh but maybe also try for many people it's not clear what the actual programs they've ever faced in Africa and why they're like setting up the whole basis there sure thank you um So based on something that we saw earlier that you were talking about in regards to supply chain um what I think we like I've seen a lot of logistics companies try to address supply chain some of which are trying to adjust with blockchain um but I guess why would people why why have these Farmers chosen to work with you what is it that you're offering that no one else is offering uh besides from the software that that would work with us um I've ideated and played with the System Dynamics for a long very long time and well I've worked in the in in many parts of the industry so from different angles and I'm hoping and this is this is why I select these guys because they're Risk Takers let's go that way I'm hoping that we have a new ideation uh I started doing this because I thought you know it needs to be done and it kind of swallowed my own posing kind of thing and to stop lecturing about it and stop start doing it um so yeah um these these guys sorry sorry I have to come back to your question sorry say it again I wanted to know why because there are a lot of solutions out there supposedly for literature supply chain and Logistics yeah so why me so why you and um I understand well I have found something out and that is supply chain systems are an inherently distributed system and what we accidentally tried to do with all these new kind of cool Solutions is that we actually link creating centralization in a system that doesn't want to be decent that doesn't want to decentralized as soon as you start to centralize supply chain you get planned economy and all the horrors that come from that so um and by by creating channels where they can flow through that are must be followed to create this centralized Solutions in it and therefore what we're doing is trying to create a system that is truly decent it's truly distributed and fully Sovereign and therefore hopefully by solving the logistics problems of a lot of other problems down the line too did I answer your question correctly yes thank you and I think I would just like to convene what David said I think I didn't think of this but but David was spot on when he said you're trying to do too much yes and I think that's part of the problem here is like any one of these things any of the one of these 10 problems that you're solving there's like there's massive teams and Thai projects and hundreds of millions of dollars gone into solving any one of these problems and you're trying to do all of this at once and I think that's that's unrealistic so that's that's so I just want to Echo that one I think that makes a lot of sense and also I did read your uh one pager which was five pages long so I would hire it but if you could convince your one pager until one page I think that will also help you on stage here on a pitch to be able to condense these ideas down and really bring it down to the core of the idea that's exactly my problem academics person I go right exactly say it in two sentences Chris yeah that's it exactly I know I know that's where I'm here so thank you but [Music] I serve God that this is maybe for for small farmers specifically not big farmers they can't be used for big farmers but it should be where it should be you know like like a grain of sand you can make a sand castle you think but it should be eat right right and this is particularly for I'm guessing also third world countries where you have a lot more of these problems because as someone who comes from a third world country and that all of these things that you mentioned are really complicated yes but also which is also a problem for you you rely you trust you need to trust someone to make the documentation yes in the first place and you just trust someone to show for work and and so the whole system relies on a base layer of trust and I didn't understand how you're gonna tackle that issue because if the guy says he's going to show up he's trust him even though he's in the system saying that he's going to show up yeah you still need to trust the guy to show up yeah so yeah um and that's um it's a difficult thing to solve because in supply chain systems if I want to be completely and brutally honest with you transparency as we say right this goes against my business case because now you can look at my suppliers and think hey he's getting a better deal than I'm getting I'm gonna snatch your customer right so I don't want to be totally honest with you as a supply chain company so if I cannot be totally honest with you how can you trust me and this is the key it's not about transparency it's about eligibility can I check and verify what you're doing if needed can I how would I know if he is doing business correctly from the outside I don't know I have no idea but if I can at least see okay he's doing a lot of business is this is this is all of the things I don't know any of these people but at least he's doing that I can trust the machine to do math right and I can say a lot about data abstractly so I can say something abstractly about the guys before I even engage with it now in the engagement because everything is so auditable and connected to each other not transparent or at least connected to each other is risking his entire reputation of being a good Merchant with this one trade with you so you see that now suddenly the dynamic actually changes that I don't want all customers I don't want to have every possible connection I am actually more concerned if if I actually want to trade with you sort of like yo it's it's similar but Yelp is again a centralized controlled system where jeld gets to say what goes on there the thing here is um I have this Epiphany on a really strange way but um I am a Dutch citizen I don't want the government to come into my house all the time right but if something goes wrong I definitely want the fire brigade to show up so I'm held responsible within my neighborhood kind of abstractly right because if I start dumping trash in my backyard right they don't show up immediately people people will say hey picture right but I don't want to become in my house so there's just there's an area of social responsibility and there's an area of no this is my house stay out right and same Dynamic happens in companies and that's why in my opinion the solution is going to break it because this solution doesn't take the assumption that everyone is going to be connected this takes the assumption that if you want you can put this in your system and make it very easy to do something very easy to draw and then the conversation becomes from why would I be transparent to why wouldn't I want to be auditable because I'm such a good guy right you could trust me and now you have the average dining place I said no all right on that note thank the last question was your final grades because we're wrapping up this night so as you start crayoning your your grades one last question from the audience huh go on all right then it's judging time if there's no question maybe I'll just take one question if you don't mind um which is so even though you need to be able to shorten your pitch and kind of bring it down to the essence of it even after reading you know the documentation provided even after having more chance to explain it as an investor I have no idea what I'm investing in yes what are the token economics uh what are the governance uh you know what is the underlying technology I I don't it's it's nothing I could really rate on here so a lot of that information is still missing so you both need to be able to condense and prioritize the important information for the context sorry thank you [Music] besides go ahead let's start thank you honest yeah but it's the same reason as Justin was just saying is and I'm I'm ready to hear from the investor I think the problem is clear to me like I'm also someone in the audience that here's a There's an actual problem um so then there's the highest rating of all scores I could give I don't see the solution yet um but you keep on working on it and I think the identification of a problem is one of the the most important things in the startup yeah so that's that's that's the thing you scored the most important all the other people still asking you figured out thank you sir oh that's all I got oh okay uh two and it's solely for showing courage and effort um the idea the pitch I didn't like Ava um but I thought but but entrepreneurship takes courage right so it's up to you when you do from here thank you yeah I'm I'm gonna gain Echo David's point because he's full of good points tonight uh yeah this is very it takes courage to stand up here and to submit yourself to criticism and uh we had a little conversation as well at the bar and I could definitely see your person open to being critiqued and then learning from that experience so don't let it discourage you and just keep building and uh you know embrace it all but I do have to give you a two for uh all of the things that I mentioned hey at least you're all in agreement there is consensus yes [Applause] thank you [Applause] um but um thank you all so much for coming to our first edition of otter tank thank you to our wonderful judges for researching spending time with the projects and your time and sharing your valuable knowledge with everyone here and to everybody online and we'll be watching this further um Tada our first grades our first Auto Tech illumini can walk ahead in their Adventures as startups David you mention it it's it's a hard world out there I promised them that the market would be harsher than tonight but at least they they go home with feedback with in person and peer-to-peer connections uh the footage that they can use and I wish all the projects all the best so round of applause for all the projects [Applause] thank you a few announcements will be resuming our normal crypto drinks uh last Wednesday of the month next 25th of October next door at Two Chefs uh we have D5 vote happening in Istanbul will be at East Rome I'll be speaking at Webb tree privacy about the tornado cash case and the latest updates Finance is joining us as of next month as a media sponsor and two two very soon oh and the next Auto tank is 31st of January so don't forget to apply thank you everybody it's a wrap